Yet another Seymour thread (and more)

[Fencer]

After a technical train wreck in the first (main) Seymour thread -- e.g. all the triple posts -- and an online-idiot train wreck in Andy's, I'm trying again.

1. A very gifted player is gone, with no assets coming back immediately. That is bad for the team this year.

2. At least, unlike some similar cases in the past, he's leaving behind a unit that's still well-stocked.

3. Seymour was my least favorite of the Pats' top players. If somebody had to go eventually, I'm glad it was him.

4. That's largely because he seemed to be the least bought-in. Besides the reasons various other people have cited, I think that because of how he threw BB under the bus after Ratgini outcoached him. BB throws himself under the bus often, but his players almost never do.

5. I do think somebody had to go eventually, based on all the usual analysis about guys coming up for their next contracts around the same time.

6. Kaczur is re-signed for multiple millions/year, but Seymour is shipped out. If that's not a strong statement about investing in a middle-class, I don't know what is.

7. Trading a 3rd this year for a high first two years from now is very much a best-case scenario. To say we got the equivalent of a 2009 3rd for Seymour is silly.

8. As for the other long-time vets:

A. Brady is staying for years. Duh.
B. Matt Light has to be hearing footsteps, in German.
C. Kevin Faulk's base-case replacement is Laurence Maroney. Maroney has other value than replacing Faulk, so there's no ticking clock on the transition. Faulk is pretty unique in the role he's played (shotgun RB for a lot of snaps, feature RB for a small but not trivial number), so it's tough to draw analogies from other players in predicting how long he'll last.

[nashvillepatsfan]

[QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Fencer

After a technical train wreck in the first (main) Seymour thread -- e.g. all the triple posts -- and an online-idiot train wreck in Andy's, I'm trying again.

amen...

4. I think that because of how he threw BB under the bus after Ratgini outcoached him. BB throws himself under the bus often, but his players almost never do.

I completely missed this. What happened?

[Fencer]

Originally Posted by nashvillepatsfan

I completely missed this. What happened?

You know how BB commonly says after a loss that not just the players on both sides of the ball, but also the coaches screwed up?

Well, that time Seymour said something similar. It's the only time I can recall a player ever saying that about BB.

[Tunescribe]

Originally Posted by Fencer

7. Trading a 3rd this year for a high first two years from now is very much a best-case scenario.

What is this "3rd" you are referring to?

[SeauOUCH]

Originally Posted by Tunescribe

What is this "3rd" you are referring to?

He is referring to the fact that since the 2011 pick is 2 years in the future its value is discounted 1 round per year out ( formula that is sometimes used on draft day when trading picks for future years ).

This is silly though for a number of reasons, give me the name of one GM that would trade a '09 3rd rounder for an '11 1st rounder. You cant because 1. Matt Millan has been fired & 2. no sane GM would ever do this. 3rd round picks are a total crap shoot while 1st round picks are absolute gold. (for the Pats anyways )

This '11 pick has the potential to be easily a top 10 pick, look at the last few picks the Pats have made in the top half of the draft..

Mayo
Big Vince
Warren
Seymour

I love how the Pats don't have the all-in mentality, yes it has the potential to cost us short term but deals like this should keep the Pats in the SB hunt for years to come. I rather weaken us slightly short term then hang on with the same aging core until the team implodes from too many old overpriced vets.

[Fencer]

Originally Posted by Tunescribe

What is this "3rd" you are referring to?

I was passing along a contention by mgteich I quite disagree with, to the effect that a 2011 first is worth a 2010 2nd, a 2010 2nd is worth a 2009 3rd, and hence Seymour was traded for a 2009 3rd in value.

[Fencer]

Originally Posted by SeauOUCH

He is referring to the fact that since the 2011 pick is 2 years in the future its value is discounted 1 round per year out ( formula that is sometimes used on draft day when trading picks for future years ).

This is silly though for a number of reasons, give me the name of one GM that would trade a '09 3rd rounder for an '11 1st rounder. You cant because 1. Matt Millan has been fired & 2. no sane GM would ever do this. 3rd round picks are a total crap shoot while 1st round picks are absolute gold. (for the Pats anyways )

This '11 pick has the potential to be easily a top 10 pick, look at the last few picks the Pats have made in the top half of the draft..

Mayo
Big Vince
Warren
Seymour

I love how the Pats don't have the all-in mentality, yes it has the potential to cost us short term but deals like this should keep the Pats in the SB hunt for years to come. I rather weaken us slightly short term then hang on with the same aging core until the team implodes from too many old overpriced vets.

Nitpick: Wilfork wasn't picked in the top half of the first round, but rather in a similar 20-something range to Meriweather, Maroney, and Grahambo.