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I am over the Patriot loss, unfortunately we are used to them losing.
One thing I think about often is how hard the Patriots work to use formations and scheme to get a 4 yard gain. Shifts, motion, stacked formulations, multiple pre-snap reads and then a pass underneath for 5 yards.
Even Simms was "marveling" at how much effort the Patriots put into a short plays.
Other teams (Ravens, Giants, etc.) seem to run much simpler plays and let their athletes make plays.
In the end, too much scheme, too much time being smart. Hopefully next year they can simplify things and go out and make plays. Maybe they need more talent to play this style but in the current state they expect almost perfect execution which becomes increasingly difficult as the competition gets more intense.
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I am over the Patriot loss, unfortunately we are used to them losing.
One thing I think about often is how hard the Patriots work to use formations and scheme their way to a 4 yard gain. Shifts, motion, stacked formulations, multiple pre-snap reads and then a pass underneath for 5 yards.
Even Simms was "marveling" at how much effort the Patriots put into a short plays.
Other teams (Ravens, Giants, etc.) seem to run much simpler plays and let their athletes make plays.
In the end, too much scheme, too much time being smart. Hopefully next year they can simplify things and go out and make plays. Maybe they need more talent to play this style but in the current state they expect almost perfect execution which becomes increasingly difficult as the competition gets more intense.
Nothing wrong with being smart as long as one can still be strong, if one is trying to be smart because one cannot be strong then there's a problem.
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I completely agree. Eveything has to be perfect to get a little pass to Welker for 5-8 yards. This does feel like a gimmick offense meant to mask athletic deficiencies. Let him go and get two real outside receivers and watch what Hernandez and Gronk can really do. Ever notice how over excited we get when welker cathes a pass that travels more than 20 yards in the air? It's because we haven't seen that from a wide receiver in a few years. I also still believe Brady can be deadly accurate with the long ball. That pass to Stallworth was the first time this season where I felt like awe **** teams are really in trouble now. Give him some real deep outside targets and Brady will destroy teams. Teams have no respect for our deep game AT ALL.
I completely agree. Eveything has to be perfect to get a little pass to Welker for 5-8 yards. This does feel like a gimmick offense meant to mask athletic deficiencies. Let him go and get two real outside receivers and watch what Hernandez and Gronk can really do. Ever notice how over excited we get when welker cathes a pass that travels more than 20 yards in the air? It's because we haven't seen that from a wide receiver in a few years. I also still believe Brady can be deadly accurate with the long ball. That pass to Stallworth was the first time this season where I felt like awe **** teams are really in trouble now. Give him some real deep outside targets and Brady will destroy teams. Teams have no respect for our deep game AT ALL.
As strange as it sounds when the Pats played Houston and Stallworth was on the field I felt really good about the offense. The deep shot was there, with Branch and Lloyd there was no threat.
Stallworth practiced for only a couple of days and I sure only had a few basic routes (Bubble screen, deep post, come back). Rather than over think they just asked him to go out and play, drive the Safeties back.
Imagine having not one but TWO outside receivers that can do with Hernandez, Gronk, and Ridley on the field at the SAME time. Jesus how hard is it to get wide recievers that can run a few routes and threaten to beat their man deep?
I am over the Patriot loss, unfortunately we are used to them losing.
One thing I think about often is how hard the Patriots work to use formations and scheme to get a 4 yard gain. Shifts, motion, stacked formulations, multiple pre-snap reads and then a pass underneath for 5 yards.
Even Simms was "marveling" at how much effort the Patriots put into a short plays.
Other teams (Ravens, Giants, etc.) seem to run much simpler plays and let their athletes make plays.
In the end, too much scheme, too much time being smart. Hopefully next year they can simplify things and go out and make plays. Maybe they need more talent to play this style but in the current state they expect almost perfect execution which becomes increasingly difficult as the competition gets more intense.
I don't understand your point.
They aren't trying to trick their way to 4 yards. They are trying to create mismatches and identify the coverage.
An example is why do you put a man in motion? Because if it is man, the defender follows, if it is zone, they shift.
Once the ball is snapped, you aren't 'relying on talent' any more or less if you shifted or motioned before it.
What do you think is gained by mot having a scheme?
If the Ravens defenders were manhandling the Pats' receivers, those shifts, motions, and stacked formations were what the Pats needed to do. All that movement and bunched formations helps to give receivers a clean release from the line and not allowing the defenders to as easily to lay wood when the receiver catches the ball.
I don't get the rational on this board some times. After every loss, all these wild theories come pouring in.
I can only say of all the things I was scratching my head about with the Pats during that game, complicated schemes were not on my list. In fact, I wondered if they weren't complicated enough because the Ravens' defense in the second half didn't have much problem figuring them out at least in the red zone.
I completely agree. Eveything has to be perfect to get a little pass to Welker for 5-8 yards. This does feel like a gimmick offense meant to mask athletic deficiencies. Let him go and get two real outside receivers and watch what Hernandez and Gronk can really do. Ever notice how over excited we get when welker cathes a pass that travels more than 20 yards in the air? It's because we haven't seen that from a wide receiver in a few years. I also still believe Brady can be deadly accurate with the long ball. That pass to Stallworth was the first time this season where I felt like awe **** teams are really in trouble now. Give him some real deep outside targets and Brady will destroy teams. Teams have no respect for our deep game AT ALL.
You do realize that the 2012 Patriot offense was the 3rd highest scoring in NFL hisotry? That the passing offense that you think has to have everything perfect to complete a little pass, threw for the 2nd most yards in NFL history the year before? That the 2010 and 2011 offense were the 10th and 12th highest scoring of all time?
Quite a case you make for the entire scheme being dysfunctional and needing to be scrapped.
As strange as it sounds when the Pats played Houston and Stallworth was on the field I felt really good about the offense. The deep shot was there, with Branch and Lloyd there was no threat.
Stallworth practiced for only a couple of days and I sure only had a few basic routes (Bubble screen, deep post, come back). Rather than over think they just asked him to go out and play, drive the Safeties back.
Maybe it is simple as upgrading Branch.
Funny, the spin the week before the Texans' playoff game was how the offense completely stalled when they were forced to throw deep.
And Stallworth had only one catch in that game (targeted one other time). Yes, it was a 63 yard TD, but he was a non-factor the rest of the game. And he only played 20 of the 70 offensive plays in that game (and I think some of them were in garbage time). Yet, his presence alone made you like the offense better. Really? I don't even notice him other than the TD pass.
I don't understand your point.
They aren't trying to trick their way to 4 yards. They are trying to create mismatches and identify the coverage.
An example is why do you put a man in motion? Because if it is man, the defender follows, if it is zone, they shift.
Once the ball is snapped, you aren't 'relying on talent' any more or less if you shifted or motioned before it.
What do you think is gained by mot having a scheme?
I think the overall sentiment is that the Patriots relied too much on these schemes that, once neutralized by capable teams, revealed worrying ability to get the 'athletic' play.
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The Patriots have been overachievers the past two years. It doesn't have the talent to compensate for injuries, and it wins so much because it puts in 99% effort in the regular season and plays with terrific schemes to mask its deficiencies.
But in the playoffs a good team at 99% will not beat emotional, talented teams that play at 100%. It's what happened against the Giants in 2011 and the Ravens in 2012.
35Likes
Too much scheme...
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